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	<title>Comments on: To GunLoons , Facts Are Strange Things</title>
	<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/</link>
	<description>Always Correct, It's A Gift</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 00:15:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: B</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-927</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:05:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-927</guid>
					<description>“For the record, an SKS should have been part of the AWB.”

It was not part of the AWB since it does not meet the definition of an AW in the federal and most if not all state and local bans.

In fact, California (which revised its AWB to “close loopholes” and ban “copycats”) STILL does not ban SKS’s. 
Comment by Jay 
 
Ummm... maybe thats because its not an AW!!! Well that was hard to figure out. It is nothing like an ak-47, wasr-10 or any other &quot;assault rifle&quot; as you like to call them! Wouldn't any weapon used in an assault be an AW? 

Anyway...

It (an sks) isn't &quot;an AK-47 type rifle&quot; or &quot;similar to the AK-47.&quot; (Or, as one widely-circulated newspaper story grotesquely claimed, &quot;based on the AK-47&quot; - a neat trick if it were true, since the SKS was in existence years before the AK-47 was designed!) As you know by now if you've been reading the preceding pages, the only things it has in common with the AK-47 is that they both were designed by Russians and they use the same ammunition. 

It isn't a weapon of great or &quot;devastating&quot; power. The 7.62x39mm. round is ballistically similar to the well-known American .30-30, which most experts consider the lightest round acceptable for deer hunting. It is much less powerful than the M-16, or the typical full-power military or sporting rifle. It is true that it will penetrate the typical police protective vest. So will any reasonably effective defensive or sporting firearm, including a muzzle-loading Kentucky rifle. (http://www.sff.net/people/sanders/sks4.html) Couldn't have said it better myself! sorry. Just saving time.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>“For the record, an SKS should have been part of the AWB.”</p>
	<p>It was not part of the AWB since it does not meet the definition of an AW in the federal and most if not all state and local bans.</p>
	<p>In fact, California (which revised its AWB to “close loopholes” and ban “copycats”) STILL does not ban SKS’s.<br />
Comment by Jay </p>
	<p>Ummm&#8230; maybe thats because its not an AW!!! Well that was hard to figure out. It is nothing like an ak-47, wasr-10 or any other &#8220;assault rifle&#8221; as you like to call them! Wouldn&#8217;t any weapon used in an assault be an AW? </p>
	<p>Anyway&#8230;</p>
	<p>It (an sks) isn&#8217;t &#8220;an AK-47 type rifle&#8221; or &#8220;similar to the AK-47.&#8221; (Or, as one widely-circulated newspaper story grotesquely claimed, &#8220;based on the AK-47&#8243; - a neat trick if it were true, since the SKS was in existence years before the AK-47 was designed!) As you know by now if you&#8217;ve been reading the preceding pages, the only things it has in common with the AK-47 is that they both were designed by Russians and they use the same ammunition. </p>
	<p>It isn&#8217;t a weapon of great or &#8220;devastating&#8221; power. The 7.62x39mm. round is ballistically similar to the well-known American .30-30, which most experts consider the lightest round acceptable for deer hunting. It is much less powerful than the M-16, or the typical full-power military or sporting rifle. It is true that it will penetrate the typical police protective vest. So will any reasonably effective defensive or sporting firearm, including a muzzle-loading Kentucky rifle. (http://www.sff.net/people/sanders/sks4.html) Couldn&#8217;t have said it better myself! sorry. Just saving time.
</p>
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		<title>by: Sebastian-PGP</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-872</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 22:19:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-872</guid>
					<description>Marc,
Nothing in that pathetic rant of yours changed the simple fact that the UK had a low homicide rate BEFORE they enacted strict gun control laws.  You didn't even try to address that point.

Let's review:  before gun control, low gun crime rates.  After gun control, low (but growing) gun crime rates.

The only person pulling anything from their ass is you.  You didn't even try to address the larger point, which was that the UK had low gun crime rates before they passed a bunch of draconian, anti freedom laws.  You simply assumed because they have low gun crime rates today it must be because of gun control laws...a stupid theory blown out of the water by the fact that they had low gun crime rates well before gun control came to town 100 years ago...but rather than acknowledge that, you're sticking your fingers in your ear and screaming like a schoolgirl.

Even Jadedouche himself posted a link that showed that the UK had a low gun crime rate by anybody's standards.  

And you consider yourself a journalist?  Pathetic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Marc,<br />
Nothing in that pathetic rant of yours changed the simple fact that the UK had a low homicide rate BEFORE they enacted strict gun control laws.  You didn&#8217;t even try to address that point.</p>
	<p>Let&#8217;s review:  before gun control, low gun crime rates.  After gun control, low (but growing) gun crime rates.</p>
	<p>The only person pulling anything from their ass is you.  You didn&#8217;t even try to address the larger point, which was that the UK had low gun crime rates before they passed a bunch of draconian, anti freedom laws.  You simply assumed because they have low gun crime rates today it must be because of gun control laws&#8230;a stupid theory blown out of the water by the fact that they had low gun crime rates well before gun control came to town 100 years ago&#8230;but rather than acknowledge that, you&#8217;re sticking your fingers in your ear and screaming like a schoolgirl.</p>
	<p>Even Jadedouche himself posted a link that showed that the UK had a low gun crime rate by anybody&#8217;s standards.  </p>
	<p>And you consider yourself a journalist?  Pathetic.
</p>
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		<title>by: Marc McDonald</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-863</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 21:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-863</guid>
					<description>Hi Sebastian,
Re:
&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;they had a low murder rate EVEN
&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;BEFORE they had strict gun control
&amp;gt;&amp;gt;&amp;gt;laws.

Where, exactly, are you getting this information from? Your ass?
The fact is, England and Wales had an incredibly low 50 gun murders in 
2005/06.
By the blood-soaked standards of America, that number is practically
unfathomable. 50 people are shot dead with guns here in the U.S. on
a typical day.
That's really the only stat that matters. Everything else is just
muddying the waters. You can talk all you want to about how England's
gun control has nothing to do with its tiny firearm murder rate, but
frankly (outside of the NRA Kool-Aid drinkers) I really don't think
your arguments are going to be taken seriously by the majority of 
Americans (who are sick and tired of senseless gun violence). Oh,
and as taxpayers, we're also sick and tired of being forced to foot
the tab for the staggering cost of gunshot injuries, which cost America
$20 billion a year (80 percent of which is paid for with taxpayer dollars).

Marc McDonald
http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Hi Sebastian,<br />
Re:<br />
&gt;&gt;&gt;they had a low murder rate EVEN<br />
&gt;&gt;&gt;BEFORE they had strict gun control<br />
&gt;&gt;&gt;laws.</p>
	<p>Where, exactly, are you getting this information from? Your ass?<br />
The fact is, England and Wales had an incredibly low 50 gun murders in<br />
2005/06.<br />
By the blood-soaked standards of America, that number is practically<br />
unfathomable. 50 people are shot dead with guns here in the U.S. on<br />
a typical day.<br />
That&#8217;s really the only stat that matters. Everything else is just<br />
muddying the waters. You can talk all you want to about how England&#8217;s<br />
gun control has nothing to do with its tiny firearm murder rate, but<br />
frankly (outside of the NRA Kool-Aid drinkers) I really don&#8217;t think<br />
your arguments are going to be taken seriously by the majority of<br />
Americans (who are sick and tired of senseless gun violence). Oh,<br />
and as taxpayers, we&#8217;re also sick and tired of being forced to foot<br />
the tab for the staggering cost of gunshot injuries, which cost America<br />
$20 billion a year (80 percent of which is paid for with taxpayer dollars).</p>
	<p>Marc McDonald<br />
<a href='http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com' rel='nofollow'>http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com</a>
</p>
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		<title>by: Sebastian-PGP</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-846</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:53:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-846</guid>
					<description>Wow, Marc, I'm surprised you had the guts to come post somewhere that you can't simply stifle the comments from people that disagree with you.

The point you're missing isn't that England has a low murder rate.  We're not disagreeing.  What we're pointing out is that they had a low murder rate EVEN BEFORE they had strict gun control laws.  

I'm surprised you're trying to argue that England's low murder rate is gun law related--as anyone with two fucking brain cells would also realize that you'd have to establish that they had a higher murder rate before the gun control laws came along.  Unfortunately...that's not the case, and thus all your ranting is for naught.  England actually has seen gun crime go UP and not down since they confiscated all the legally registered handguns.  The murder rate in the UK has always been minimal (which is a cultural phenomena, not a legal one), and was so well before they went around the bend on gun control.

No wonder you don't allow comments on your blog; having people eviscerate your arguments is embarrassing, isn't it?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Wow, Marc, I&#8217;m surprised you had the guts to come post somewhere that you can&#8217;t simply stifle the comments from people that disagree with you.</p>
	<p>The point you&#8217;re missing isn&#8217;t that England has a low murder rate.  We&#8217;re not disagreeing.  What we&#8217;re pointing out is that they had a low murder rate EVEN BEFORE they had strict gun control laws.  </p>
	<p>I&#8217;m surprised you&#8217;re trying to argue that England&#8217;s low murder rate is gun law related&#8211;as anyone with two fucking brain cells would also realize that you&#8217;d have to establish that they had a higher murder rate before the gun control laws came along.  Unfortunately&#8230;that&#8217;s not the case, and thus all your ranting is for naught.  England actually has seen gun crime go UP and not down since they confiscated all the legally registered handguns.  The murder rate in the UK has always been minimal (which is a cultural phenomena, not a legal one), and was so well before they went around the bend on gun control.</p>
	<p>No wonder you don&#8217;t allow comments on your blog; having people eviscerate your arguments is embarrassing, isn&#8217;t it?
</p>
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		<title>by: Jay</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-845</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:52:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-845</guid>
					<description>&quot;For the record, an SKS should have been part of the AWB.&quot;

It was not part of the AWB since it does not meet the definition of an AW in the federal and most if not all state and local bans.

In fact, California (which revised its AWB to &quot;close loopholes&quot; and ban &quot;copycats&quot;) STILL does not ban SKS's.

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>&#8220;For the record, an SKS should have been part of the AWB.&#8221;</p>
	<p>It was not part of the AWB since it does not meet the definition of an AW in the federal and most if not all state and local bans.</p>
	<p>In fact, California (which revised its AWB to &#8220;close loopholes&#8221; and ban &#8220;copycats&#8221;) STILL does not ban SKS&#8217;s.
</p>
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		<title>by: Jay</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-844</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 16:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-844</guid>
					<description>(This is my first comment since my original Dec 6 post -- there appears to be another Jay.)

As has been pointed out, most news reports specify an &quot;AK47 type rifle.&quot; My original post was based upon reports on the web sites of the Brady Campaign and the Violence Policy Center. I have long known that much of what they print is inaccurate -- apparently, I will now have to assume that EVEN MORE of what they print is inaccurate. Both have now changed that part of their sites. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>(This is my first comment since my original Dec 6 post &#8212; there appears to be another Jay.)</p>
	<p>As has been pointed out, most news reports specify an &#8220;AK47 type rifle.&#8221; My original post was based upon reports on the web sites of the Brady Campaign and the Violence Policy Center. I have long known that much of what they print is inaccurate &#8212; apparently, I will now have to assume that EVEN MORE of what they print is inaccurate. Both have now changed that part of their sites.
</p>
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		<title>by: Marc McDonald</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-843</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2007 13:49:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-843</guid>
					<description>Thanks for your kind words.
You know, I'm kind of surprised that the gun nuts would even challenge the stats on gun murders in England.
Any reasonably intelligent person knows that England has only a very small number of gun homicides per year.
I mentioned that England has around 30 gun murders a year (actually, it was around 50 in 2005/2006) and the gun nuts went apesh*t and started trotting out all these (totally irrelevent) stats on vague crimes like &quot;gun crimes&quot; and total homicides in England.
But they don't seem able to confront the reality that THERE WERE ONLY 50 GUN MURDERS IN ENGLAND IN 2005/06 and that ANY PERSON WITH TWO F*CKING BRAIN CELLS COULD FIGURE OUT THAT THIS IS BECAUSE ENGLAND RESTRICTS GUNS.

Marc McDonald
http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Thanks for your kind words.<br />
You know, I&#8217;m kind of surprised that the gun nuts would even challenge the stats on gun murders in England.<br />
Any reasonably intelligent person knows that England has only a very small number of gun homicides per year.<br />
I mentioned that England has around 30 gun murders a year (actually, it was around 50 in 2005/2006) and the gun nuts went apesh*t and started trotting out all these (totally irrelevent) stats on vague crimes like &#8220;gun crimes&#8221; and total homicides in England.<br />
But they don&#8217;t seem able to confront the reality that THERE WERE ONLY 50 GUN MURDERS IN ENGLAND IN 2005/06 and that ANY PERSON WITH TWO F*CKING BRAIN CELLS COULD FIGURE OUT THAT THIS IS BECAUSE ENGLAND RESTRICTS GUNS.</p>
	<p>Marc McDonald<br />
<a href='http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com' rel='nofollow'>http://www.beggarscanbechoosers.com</a>
</p>
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		<title>by: Sebastian-PGP</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-831</link>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 23:25:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-831</guid>
					<description>Oh, and for the last fucking time, a WASR-10 is NOT an AK47.

Any more than an AR15 is an M4 or a Toyota is a Nissan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Oh, and for the last fucking time, a WASR-10 is NOT an AK47.</p>
	<p>Any more than an AR15 is an M4 or a Toyota is a Nissan.
</p>
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		<title>by: Sebastian-PGP</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-830</link>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 23:24:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-830</guid>
					<description>As anyone can see, I can verify with links and documentation that the SKS is in fact used in hunting applications.  I actually substantiate my arguments.  You should try it sometime, Jadepenis.

Most hunting in wooded and brush areas is done at less than 100 yards, a range at which the SKS is more than adequately accurate.  Have you ever actually shot one?  How do you know how accurate it is?

Nice to see you're stooping to sexist humor instead of stopping by my place for your uh...&quot;instruction&quot;. 

Your mendacity is exceeding only by your cowardice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>As anyone can see, I can verify with links and documentation that the SKS is in fact used in hunting applications.  I actually substantiate my arguments.  You should try it sometime, Jadepenis.</p>
	<p>Most hunting in wooded and brush areas is done at less than 100 yards, a range at which the SKS is more than adequately accurate.  Have you ever actually shot one?  How do you know how accurate it is?</p>
	<p>Nice to see you&#8217;re stooping to sexist humor instead of stopping by my place for your uh&#8230;&#8221;instruction&#8221;. </p>
	<p>Your mendacity is exceeding only by your cowardice.
</p>
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		<title>by: Sebastian-PGP</title>
		<link>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-829</link>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Dec 2007 23:21:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://leftrudder.blogsome.com/2007/12/09/to-gunloons-facts-are-strange-things/#comment-829</guid>
					<description>http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><a href='http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html' rel='nofollow'>http://www.victorinc.com/SKS-FAQ.html</a>
</p>
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